Football falls to No. 2 ND State 41-24

[Chris Datres 455]

I can never understand how year after year, our special teams is an abomination.  A blocked punt and a PR TD allowed plus if the NDSU holder fields the snap cleanly, he walks into the endzone on the fake FG.  It's not a question of if but when a special teams gaffe is going to cost us.  And it happens year after year after year after year.

I only saw the first half so my view of the game is going to be skewed.  Seeing Davis for the first time, I think he's got dynamic potential but as Mat said, he's inconsistent.  That first drive, he puts more air on the ball on the scramble drill and he's got a wide open TD (fortunate it wasn't picked).  A couple of times after executing the play fake, he had wide lanes of running room to his right but he refused to pull it and take off.  That takes awareness and he wasn't showing much in the first half.  I guess the 2nd half was encouraging other than the defense's ability to get off the field, another something that has plagued us over the last number of years.

[mat1992 2,373]

8 minutes ago, Chris Datres said:

I can never understand how year after year, our special teams is an abomination.  A blocked punt and a PR TD allowed plus if the NDSU holder fields the snap cleanly, he walks into the endzone on the fake FG.  It's not a question of if but when a special teams gaffe is going to cost us.  And it happens year after year after year after year.

I only saw the first half so my view of the game is going to be skewed.  Seeing Davis for the first time, I think he's got dynamic potential but as Mat said, he's inconsistent.  That first drive, he puts more air on the ball on the scramble drill and he's got a wide open TD (fortunate it wasn't picked).  A couple of times after executing the play fake, he had wide lanes of running room to his right but he refused to pull it and take off.  That takes awareness and he wasn't showing much in the first half.  I guess the 2nd half was encouraging other than the defense's ability to get off the field, another something that has plagued us over the last number of years.

Davis ran a lot more in the second half, but he's not a big runner and right now, I would understand if he just ran out of bounds with his left shoulder issue.

As far as potential, I believe, counting juco, this is his fourth team in four seasons. I don't know about potential, but if he's healthy, he'd better start getting things going in two weeks. The problem I see with Shinnick is that he won't replace his QB and hasn't yet, unless there is an injury. He didn't even use Brown or Scott Smith last season when were getting blown out. He only used Brown late in the season against URI when Kent was banged up late in the game. But to Pete's credit, he was right with staying with Davis, even after his poor interception on the first drive of the second half. I'd have pulled him, Gordy said he'd pull him at the half, but he played much better in the second half. Most of the throws were short to get him confidence. We have a pretty good offensive line even without LT Dan Volpe, some solid receivers and a great tight end. How the heck are we this bad in the passing game? Is it Davis, the play design, receivers not getting open, because Davis and Brown both have had plenty of time to throw, opposing defenses throwing different looks at us?

[Tiger93 314]

Made the roundtrip there and back from the Twin Cities today (about 3:15 each way), so I really appreciated the fight in the second half to make the game interesting. This team has definitely shown some fight in the first four games, but I still feel like we don't know much about them. The NDSU offense is pretty good this year, but that is a somewhat subpar NDSU defense for that program. We didn't put enough pressure on them early when we could have made this a tighter game. 

Our first drive was pretty solid, but Davis missed an opportunity to get a TD on the third down play when he couldn't quite get enough air on his pass to get it to an open receiver. It was a difficult roll-out play, but one that could have been made.

On our next two drives, we got decent yardage on first and second down but couldn't executive on 3rd and 3 and 3rd and 4 due to a combination of breakdowns. It felt like one at least one of those third down plays, Davis could have run for the first down. He made that adjustment very well in the second half, but it was probably too late at that point.

I only listened on the radio last week, but was wondering what others think about the comp with Brown's throwing arm compared to Davis. It felt like there were 3-4 above average throws that Davis missed today that could have been big plays. He also had the jitters early on, and it seemed like his accuracy was off a little bit. 

Meanwhile four of NDSU's five 3rd down conversions in the game came on 3rd and 9 or longer. With the game tied at 3-3, we had them at 3rd and 10 from their own 30, and they came up with a 49-yard pass play to keep a drive that ended up as a TD alive. Late in the second quarter at 17-3, NDSU seemed content to run the clock out and was at 3rd and 11 from their own. Once they completed a 16 yard pass play, they quickly drove down the field and made it 24-3. They converted a 3rd and 15 from their own 39 in their first drive on the second half on pass interference, but thankfully missed a 44-yard field goal. They also had a 3rd and 9 from our 22-yard line and converted on a pass interference play, and pushed the score to 31-10 later in the third quarter. 

I know I am being picky pulling up each of those plays, but between the two punt play letdowns, the two PIs on 3rd and long, and the two other 3rd and long spots we gave up, we just had too many letdowns to make this as tight of a game as it could have been. That was little disappointing.

I know some of the big plays we made against NDSU and Cincy show off some of the talent on this team, but finding yourself down 21-3 in the first quarter in Cincy and 24-3 at halftime against NDSU helps loosen the intensity of those defenses too. Our best offense has come try to claw our way back from huge deficits, and I hope we don't see many more of those this year.

I also don't think NDSU is a top five team and that Villanova is a top 10 squad. They are still good teams, but both are a tad overrated from what I can tell. Still, credit the players for fighting hard the whole game and for making some adjustments in the second half. Davis did a good job of using his legs when things broke down offensively in the second half, and the Tyrell Greene Jr. TD run was a thing of beauty. We actually almost came close to replicating it with Devin Matthews when it was 34-24, but NDSU's safety made a solid one-on-one tackle to keep it from being a big gain and the drive broke down because of penalties. 

Overall, I was a little disappointed with some of the mistakes that let us fall behind by so much in the first half. Those mistakes won't just hurt us against NDSU and Cincinnati, we will pay for themi in conference play if we don't clean them up.

The talent level and the fact that our total yardage has been 438, 346, 394, 366 in the first four games (even if we piled up a lot of it against NDSU and Cincy when we trailed big) are both promising. We have also run for 5.2 (194) total, 5.1 (137 total), 5.2 (161 total) and 8.5 (205 total) yards per carry in our first four games.

We just need to clean up special teams and some of the mistakes we have made on both sides of the ball. They made the Morgan State game closer than it should have been, they cost us the Villanova game, and they blew a chance for this to be a really tight and competitive game against NDSU the whole way. 

 

 

[mat1992 2,373]

Nice analysis Tiger93. I didn’t think Davis should have played in the first place because he’s not 100%, but I think when healthy, his arm is comparable to Brown’s. That long bomb to Doss that was right on the money against Morgan and the back shoulder paas to Dunmore yesterday was a thing of beauty. Then he misses Doss on that first drive and you had to wonder if was worried about the shoulder or taking a shot out of the pocket, which he did late in the game. Also, for whatever reason, he completed almost all of his passes to Dunmore and Runyon and didn’t spread it out to the others.

[sr16 180]

yeah in the first half Carlos didn't look 100% but that fade to dunmore was a beauty. Think Sean brown should have been given a go. 

[TheGoldCrotchPiece 99]

watch most of the game and have mix emotions with the same frustrations about the outcome as always with Towson sports.

My takeaways

• yeah it's an NDSU broadcast but awesome it was on ESPN+ so free for me. sure it's not full ESPN level production quality but sooo much better than we get most weeks because they get local coverage. If I have to hear about Combs' beach house or lack of shoe wearing one more time.... might be time to start a second Fire Gordy campaign. 
• NDSU is very good but this isn't the NDSU of old. (winning all those titles, beating K state, etc.) South Dakota State is the new NDSU. If we got the team that showed up vs ETSU maybe we catch them napping but NDSU got the wake-up call last week. 
• was jacked after our first drive and with the first quarter in general. I was like okay we are in this and maybe just maybe it could happen
• second quarter - classic Towson. saw the punt block coming from a mile away. if we hadn't given up the punt return we might have had a tie game during the Q4 comeback
• super proud of the guys for the comeback effort, made the second half worth watching.
• on the 4th down play in the 4th, down only 10 Davis had the man open streaking to the endzone with the DB just getting a piece. that was the killer
• why are we seemingly the only team in the nation who can't get a kickoff near the goalline? we are giving teams 10-15 yards on each drive to start. so frustrating
• our starts have been bad (outside of the first drive this week). why are we not prepared to go. second halves have been much improved but we have yet to play a full 60 or even close.
• D was good but we asked them to do too much. I generally don't care about time of possession but can't be that lopsided in a close game 
• Lost the turnover battle - classic recipe to not win. 

The game was there - we did not capitalize on the moment. Another in a long line of missed opportunities to change the narrative and get that statement win.

[mat1992 2,373]

1 hour ago, TheGoldCrotchPiece said:

watch most of the game and have mix emotions with the same frustrations about the outcome as always with Towson sports.

My takeaways

• yeah it's an NDSU broadcast but awesome it was on ESPN+ so free for me. sure it's not full ESPN level production quality but sooo much better than we get most weeks because they get local coverage. If I have to hear about Combs' beach house or lack of shoe wearing one more time.... might be time to start a second Fire Gordy campaign. 
• NDSU is very good but this isn't the NDSU of old. (winning all those titles, beating K state, etc.) South Dakota State is the new NDSU. If we got the team that showed up vs ETSU maybe we catch them napping but NDSU got the wake-up call last week. 
• was jacked after our first drive and with the first quarter in general. I was like okay we are in this and maybe just maybe it could happen
• second quarter - classic Towson. saw the punt block coming from a mile away. if we hadn't given up the punt return we might have had a tie game during the Q4 comeback
• super proud of the guys for the comeback effort, made the second half worth watching.
• on the 4th down play in the 4th, down only 10 Davis had the man open streaking to the endzone with the DB just getting a piece. that was the killer
• why are we seemingly the only team in the nation who can't get a kickoff near the goalline? we are giving teams 10-15 yards on each drive to start. so frustrating
• our starts have been bad (outside of the first drive this week). why are we not prepared to go. second halves have been much improved but we have yet to play a full 60 or even close.
• D was good but we asked them to do too much. I generally don't care about time of possession but can't be that lopsided in a close game 
• Lost the turnover battle - classic recipe to not win. 

The game was there - we did not capitalize on the moment. Another in a long line of missed opportunities to change the narrative and get that statement win.

As for the kickoffs going to the 10 every time, Justin Ritter is not the normal kick off specialist. It was Caden Williams last season and he's still listed on the roster. He was pretty good. Ed might be able to fill us in why he's not playing (hurt?). Vaughn's kickoffs were not great so they went to Ritter, who kicks to the 10 just about every time. I thought the kick coverage was pretty good until that last one when that freshman just ran past us (again). Punt coverage was terrible on that return for a TD, but I think we changed up to have two blockers up front due to the block. That probably screwed things up.

Agree that ND State is still very good but not great. Though ETSU must have a pretty good offense as they put up 34 points at Elon on Saturday night. 

The punt and special team blunders are very Towson-like. I was having nightmares of 2014 at Frisco when I nearly walked out of the press box after the blocked FG attempt. I don't think it was quite as bad last season because Vaughn was 15 of 18 on FGs. The punting was strange because they used two and Ritter was more the rugby style, which is tougher to block, but the ball goes about 35 yards in the air at best. Returns were better because of D'Ago Hunter and Londono wasn't bad on punt returns. Londono is banged up. Dunmore mostly fair catches the ball and Doss can't break tackles on kick returns because he's very slight (175pds).

You are 100% right on the defense getting worn down because they were on the field 40 minutes. That's mostly on the offense, but the third-down and long defense is dreadful. Not really about fatigue. The safeties are struggling to be kind. Brown's running at the end when he was just running over guys. That was probably fatigue although we sub more than any other defense I've every seen (not as much in the secondary)

I don't know about the starts being bad because other than Morgan State, we were the inferior team in three of the four games, though we should have beaten the overrated No. 5 Villanova Wildcats. 

I don't see turnovers as a huge problem in the first four games. Yes, the Davis pick was bad, but we have only one pick by our QBs in four games and two lost fumbles. We haven't forced a pick (that's a problem), but we do have five fumble recoveries so +2. To beat the Bison, we needed to be +2 at least to win it and we weren't. But for the most part, we're taking care of the ball.

BTW, some of this is based on the opposition, and we had just four penalties against ND State, but we're averaging 6.8 penalties per game. Need more discipline. I will post in another thread about stats in the first four games.

[Tiger93 314]

17 minutes ago, mat1992 said:

As for the kickoffs going to the 10 every time, Justin Ritter is not the normal kick off specialist. It was Caden Williams last season and he's still listed on the roster. He was pretty good. Ed might be able to fill us in why he's not playing (hurt?). Vaughn's kickoffs were not great so they went to Ritter, who kicks to the 10 just about every time. I thought the kick coverage was pretty good until that last one when that freshman just ran past us (again). Punt coverage was terrible on that return for a TD, but I think we changed up to have two blockers up front due to the block. That probably screwed things up.

Agree that ND State is still very good but not great. Though ETSU must have a pretty good offense as they put up 34 points at Elon on Saturday night. 

The punt and special team blunders are very Towson-like. I was having nightmares of 2014 at Frisco when I nearly walked out of the press box after the blocked FG attempt. I don't think it was quite as bad last season because Vaughn was 15 of 18 on FGs. The punting was strange because they used two and Ritter was more the rugby style, which is tougher to block, but the ball goes about 35 yards in the air at best. Returns were better because of D'Ago Hunter and Londono wasn't bad on punt returns. Londono is banged up. Dunmore mostly fair catches the ball and Doss can't break tackles on kick returns because he's very slight (175pds).

You are 100% right on the defense getting worn down because they were on the field 40 minutes. That's mostly on the offense, but the third-down and long defense is dreadful. Not really about fatigue. The safeties are struggling to be kind. Brown's running at the end when he was just running over guys. That was probably fatigue although we sub more than any other defense I've every seen (not as much in the secondary)

I don't know about the starts being bad because other than Morgan State, we were the inferior team in three of the four games, though we should have beaten the overrated No. 5 Villanova Wildcats. 

I don't see turnovers as a huge problem in the first four games. Yes, the Davis pick was bad, but we have only one pick by our QBs in four games and two lost fumbles. We haven't forced a pick (that's a problem), but we do have five fumble recoveries so +2. To beat the Bison, we needed to be +2 at least to win it and we weren't. But for the most part, we're taking care of the ball.

BTW, some of this is based on the opposition, and we had just four penalties against ND State, but we're averaging 6.8 penalties per game. Need more discipline. I will post in another thread about stats in the first four games.

The punt return was a nice punt. I don't always buy the "outkicking your coverage" notion, but 81 Jackson Williams was one of the players the NDSU fans seemed excited about and he had too much space to run on that punt. We probably didn't fill the lanes we needed to, but just seemed like a flew right past us.

I didn't specifically bring up time of possession, but I definitely alluded to it in that I felt going three-and-out on our second and third drive after getting ourselves in third and relatively short positions really hurt us in a number of ways. We lost some of the swagger we had on our first drive, we gave our defense no rest, and we let NDSU feel like they were in control of the game. I pretty much was wondering how big the blowout was going to be when it got 24-3. We adjusted fairly well with the gameplan in the second half, but I wish we could have stemmed the tide a little better in the first half.

Even if one of those drives goes 7-10 plays, I think we stay in that game enough to be dangerous. Although, I will also say that NDSU really dropped their intensity on defense in the second half, and we upped our execution. That is why it is so hard to tell what is real and what isn't as we head into conference play and face more manageable competition. Better starts and less mistakes will be big part. 

[TheGoldCrotchPiece 99]

On 9/23/2024 at 11:24 AM, mat1992 said:

I don't see turnovers as a huge problem in the first four games. Yes, the Davis pick was bad, but we have only one pick by our QBs in four games and two lost fumbles. We haven't forced a pick (that's a problem), but we do have five fumble recoveries so +2. To beat the Bison, we needed to be +2 at least to win it and we weren't. But for the most part, we're taking care of the ball.

BTW, some of this is based on the opposition, and we had just four penalties against ND State, but we're averaging 6.8 penalties per game. Need more discipline. I will post in another thread about stats in the first four games.

Yeah, agree it isn't in my mind we are not going to commit turnovers just we can't seem to win the turnover battle and you need to do that to pull an upset. +2 we are in the game

discipline, yes! maybe the downside of Pete being so positive and what I'm guessing is viewed as a player's coach.  penalties, special teams blunders, etc. we are giving teams free yardage and need to limit that to be successful. 

Edited September 25 by TheGoldCrotchPiece

[TheGoldCrotchPiece 99]

On 9/23/2024 at 11:58 AM, Tiger93 said:

was wondering how big the blowout was going to be when it got 24-3. We adjusted fairly well with the gameplan in the second half, but I wish we could have stemmed the tide a little better in the first half.

Even if one of those drives goes 7-10 plays, I think we stay in that game enough to be dangerous. Although, I will also say that NDSU really dropped their intensity on defense in the second half, and we upped our execution. That is why it is so hard to tell what is real and what isn't as we head into conference play and face more manageable competition. Better starts and less mistakes will be big part. 

Exactly, the fact we didn't get blown out was good. Frustrating with the mistakes and missed opportunities we couldn't be more in the game.